Hey Mr. Grow it and community! I'm a brand spanking new at this and I'd like to share my journey so far. If anyone has any tips for me, I'd be very grateful. I'm hoping to take this run to completion but I'm worried about the flowering stage and adding nutrients.
Veg - day 17
I'm on day 17 since sprout. I've only added tap water so far. The two on the top are Blueberry and the two on the bottom are Purple Kush. Both are autoflower fem. They seem a little bit on the "light green" side but seem healthy so far.
Medium: I'm using this organic potting mix. I read after I started this to "never use miracle grow". But it was too late and I'm trying to still bring these girls to completion anyway.
My setup is Mars Hydro 5x5x6.5 / Spider Farmer SF4000 / 5 gal tall pots.
So far they look good. But I'm not sure when, or even if I should add Nutrence to the soil. What I've heard is to wail until 30 - 40 days before feeding anything in organic soil. Would that apply to this organic potting mix?
I'm going with Dyna-gro Foilage pro,Dyna-gro Bloom and Botanicare CalMag.
Any advice would be awesome!
Thanks so much, and happy growing!
-ryu
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Nice setup! Looks like the plants want a feeding now. Most growers start with a half dose according to the feeding chart. Check the pH and PPM of the runoff to ensure the pH is in the proper range and to get an idea of how much nutrients are in the soil. Looks like you have all the nutrients needed to make your plants happy again 🙂
Thank you for the quick response! One quick thing... Since I just watered yesterday and the first inch is still wet... should I wait until it's a bit drier to feed with nutrients?
@ryu It's a gamble either way really. If you water now you risk the plant getting overwatering symptoms. If you wait until it dries out then then plant may become more yellow.
@Mr. Grow It So I decided to feed yesterday and risk the over water. I went with Dyna-Gro Foilage Pro (1/2 dose) and save my Remo set for next time. I called Remo and they recommend non-amended "utility soil" or coco for their products. So I will try that next time. :) Thanks for your help! I'm going to go on amazon today and buy your book.
The feeding went well, I think. They don't look as "light green" as before. However, got a little more droopy from adding more water.. as expected. I'm thinking that my soils "water conserve" feature is actually making it really hard for it to dry out. I've only watered them 3 times since sprouting!
The second watering I did 1/2 gal per plant (waay too much). The third watering (with feeding) I pulled back to 1/4 gal per plant (maybe still too much for this stage).
I'll be doing slightly smaller waterings for the next few times to see if that helps.
I'm also trying LST since I'm on day 20 and the main stem is strong. This might be too ambitious for my first grow but I don't mind failing this run to learn more.
Veg - day 20
Just watered my runt (top left) and measured the runoff:
PPM = 1050
PH = 5.8
Do you think I should PH up my water if my runoff is 5.8 to get it into a 6.3 range or just leave it? (This soil is an organic potting mix)
Veg - day 23
@ryu Your plants look healthy now so if your future waterings are 6.5-6.8 then the soil should slowly drift up over time.
Do you plan to transplant or they in there final pots?
Planted in final pots. 5 gal plastic talls.
Progress!
I did some small adjustments and got rid of the drooping and they are looking happier than ever!
Veg Day 25
Adjustments:
Light Distance: I had my light (sf4000) at the recommended height 22" (the manual says to do 18-24" for veg). It was too close for these girls. I did more research on PAR and found that 27" or higher is far better for this stage of veg for Indica. Maybe even as high as 32". I'll experiment with this... I'm at 27" right now.
Humidity: I use a humidifier and was making sure it was around 60% at all times. However, I live in a humid climate and now have removed the humidifier all together. My hunch is they are absorbing a lot of their moisture from the air making it take way longer for the soil to dry out. We'll see how this goes – my humidity is naturally at 40% during the day and 60% at night. I also learned that indica likes less humidity.
Temps: I was trying to keep it at 80 - 82 before but now have switched to 76 - 78 range since these are all Indica strains. I read up on how it grows naturally in cooler/drier mountain areas. They are responding well to the cooler/drier air.
@ryu Thanks for giving us a rundown of the changes you made. I'll be following along to see how it goes. Cheers!
Day 27 Veg
Keeping temps at 76-78 humidity 40-50%. Did a full watering today (1gal per plant) and PHed my tap water to 6.8 (my tap is around 8 naturally). I wanted to get runoff on all 4 to see what PH and PPMs are at.
Top Left (runt): PH 6.04 / PPM 950
Bottom Left: PH 6.2 / PPM 730
Top Right: PH 6.3 / PPM 840
Bottom Right: PH 6.2 / PPM 970
Got this mofo in the mail! Great reference and easy to understand. Good photos in there too! Nice job @Mr. Grow It
So what I'm learning is that my PPMs are a little high for late veg. I did not feed this watering (phew). The leaves looked dark and the numbers seem to back that up.
PH seems to be in range. With my alkaline tap water (ph 8) and a little PH-Down, I should be able to slowly bring up my ph through the 6 to 7 range over time.
Also looks like the runt had some ph lockout earlier on (ph5.4 before and 6.04 now) which may have caused some of the growth stunting. But it's heading in the right direction.
@ryu Coming along great! Do you have chlorine or chloramine in your tap water? Thanks for buying my book! I'm glad you like it. Don't forget to leave a review on Amazon 😉 lol. You don't have to but if you do, I'd greatly appreciate it. Getting reviews on there is kind of like pulling teeth haha. Some phenos can handle a bit higher PPM than others. It sounds like you're on the right track overall.
@Mr. Grow It Yes, looks like I have chlorine in my tap water here in BC. Is that going to be an issue? I've been leaving my water sit for 24h before using, not sure if that helps at all. It's showing only 20PPM out of my tap. Which seems super low and makes my question if my TDS meter is broken.
I'll do a review on amazon, np!
@ryu As long as you let it sit out for 24 hours then you should be good. Some put their bucket of water in light and some also put air stones in it for the 24 hours. Those are other methods to help with the dissipation of chlorine.
day 30 veg
Did a little pruning/lollipoping. I'm hoping I didn't do it too early but hey, I'm learning as I go.
They seem to want water every 2 days now but I waited 3 days and they weren't that happy with me this morning. All I had was cold water and ended up heating a little bit of it on the stove and mixing it back in. Fingers crossed it was warm enough.
Lesson learned: Next time fill up a 10 gal bucket and leaving it inside my house for 24 hours (to remove chlorine) rather than in the garage. 😣
Didn't feed this time. These girls are almost 100% getting their food from the organic potting mix still. PPMs of this watering was 600-800. PH was around 6.4 for all of them. I'm guessing next watering I'll need to start mixing in more food.
Do you think I should use bloom nutes yet or keep going with foliage pro and slowly mix in bloom over the next month?
My runt is still looking bad/stunted/curling down (top left). Not sure what's going on with that one. Any ideas?
@ryu Since the plants are in Veg, I wouldn't feed bloom nutrients. They need lots of nitrogen during the veg stage. Stick to the ratios according to the nutrient company's feeding chart. The plant that continues to curl down may just need the medium dried out a bit more before watering? She never pops up towards the light huh?
@Mr. Grow It Yeah, she was droopy when I was a day late for watering (pot was light/the first inch dry).. and after watering, still sad and droopy. Overall leaf size is small and thin compared to her sister's leaves (both blueberry autos).
I did notice some slight yellowing on these bottom oldest leaves only. Also burnt tips. So I instantly thought of nutrient burn or potassium deficiency. What do you think?
Last I checked:
Runoff PPM = 650
Runoff PH = 6.2
She hasn't been fed since Nov 21, and this is an organic potting mix. So I'm trying to not overfeed and try to read the plant before feeding.
@ryu 650 PPM is a bit low. She may be just hungry.
Did a feed yesterday with 1/2 dose Dyna-Gro Foilage pro and 1/4 dose CalMag @ PH6.8 & 360PPM going in. Today I noticed a lot of rust spots on the lower/older leaves of my Blueberry autos.
Blueberry Auto runoff:
650PPM
PH: 6.2
Day 33 veg
From what I'm reading.. looks like a Phosphorus or Potassium deficiency. Wondering if I should add in bloom nutes on my next feed.
My Purple Kush girls seem to be ok with my horrible growing skills so far.
PK Runoff after feed:
1200 PPM
PH: 6.4
1/4 dose of CalMag is what? 2.5ml per gallon?
@Mr. Grow It I did only 1.25ml / gal of CalMag because I wasn't sure if I even really need it. What I'm noticing is after this feed they are looking happier. So I'm realizing that I'm probably underfeeding so far. Partly due to how long it takes for this "water retention" potting mix to dry out.
@ryu I was thinking underfeeding too. CalMag I've gone as high as 10ml per gal. Most tend to go with 5ml per gal.
Update: Feeding more and experimenting
Flower week 1? (I'm guessing) -- Day 37 since sprouting.
Fed all 4 today (2 left Blueberry 2 on right are Purple Kush):
Dyna Gro Foilage Pro = 3.75ml/gal
Dyna Gro Bloom = 3.75ml/gal
CalMag = 3.75ml/gal
PPM going in = 700
PH going in = 6.55
(PK) PPM runoff = 640 - 700
(PK) PH runoff = 6.45
(BB) PPM runoff = 800
(BB) PH runoff = 6.30
This was a lot more food than I have done before but still not their recommended full dose. This was more like a 3/4 dose of all three. We'll see how this goes.
I've read that Autoflowers don't need as much food, and that salt lock/buildup is very easy to do. So I've been extra careful about how much to feed and relying on the soil. But I'm thinking now the soil is running out of food and I'll need to transition to almost full nutrient feeding for the rest of flowering.
Lights update (sf4000):
I've been letting the plants grow into the light and today the taller ones are reaching 18". So I've adjusted back up to 22". Might go to 24", I'll keep an eye on it.
24 hours after feeding, looking light green / yellowish especially on the larger PK strain. I was expecting them to darken up. Maybe too early to tell?
Not sure if I should go full dose on the nutrients next time??
It usually takes more than 24 hours to see a change. 2-3 days is typically how long it takes to see the shade of green darken. The are early flower now so PPM I usually aim for is 750-950 but some phenos can take up to 1200 imo. They may just be hungry. When you feed/water, how much runoff do you get and what do you do with it? Can you tell us what your organic potting mix consists of? Wondering if it's coco based or what.
@Mr. Grow It I usually get a low clear plastic saucer worth of runoff. Maybe 2" deep. I suck that up with my shop vac and make sure they are free of water.
My potting mix has (from the website):
yucca and coir, Alfalfa Meal, Bone Meal, Earthworm Castings Kelp Meal
0.15-0.13-0.15
@ryu I also found this on their site: sphagnum peat moss, processed forest products, coir, perlite, organic fertilizer, and yucca. I bring that up because some may argue that a lower pH is better since it contains coir and peat moss.
Since it looks like they enjoyed the last feed 2 days ago.. I did another large feed today at full dose to see how they take it. They are still looking light green so we'll see how this feed does.
5ml - Foilage
5ml - CalMag
5ml - Bloom
PPM in = 920
PH in = 6.8
(PK1) Out PPM = 800 PH = 6.31
(PK2) Out PPM = 792 PH = 6.46
(BB1) Out PPM = 918 PH = 6.42
(BB2) Out PPM = 995 PH = 6.12
What I'm noticing about this potting mix is that it never really dries out. So I'm going more by pot weight now and watering every 2 days. So far this method looks like it's working and I'm not noticing any over watering problems.
Since we now know your mix is mostly peat and coir, everything you said makes sense. It doesn't hold nutrients as well so feeding more often, less chances of overwatering, and more frequent waterings. The other thing you want to consider is potentially lowering the pH, as generally advised for a soilless medium. I'm not saying that is what you should do; do your own research and make your own decisions of course. Edit: just realized I already mentioned the pH suggestion in a different post. My bad; today has been a long day lol
@Mr. Grow It Super helpful info! Thank you.
Early week 2 flowering - Day 41 since sprouting.
Watered today with tap water PHed to 5.95. I really wanted to test @Mr. Grow It theory about how using potting mix with coco and peat moss could need slightly lower PH range. I'll see how this goes.
I'm noticing my PH meter was way off and did a recalibration. It was off by nearly 0.6... So I'm losing trust in it (vivosun) and I ordered a better one. So who knows if my 5.95 water was even accurate this time.
PH in = 5.95
(BB1) Out PPM = 1170 PH = 5.95
(BB2) Out PPM = 1347 PH = 5.91
(PK1) Out PPM = 480 PH = 6.1
(PK2) Out PPM = 430 PH = 6.1
Surprised to see my PK's PPMs so low. I'll be feeding them next watering and not feeding the BBs.
WArning! Careful when using a shop vac to suck up extra runoff. I f*ckn sucked off one of my PK's large branches with flowers forming. :(((
Progress Report..
Things are going good! The lower PH and more food have been really helping.. I've been using the full recommended nutrient dose and they are happily taking it without any issues.
Had to take some photos. Those baby trichomes are getting me excited.
Progress update
Day 51 (from sprout) - Flower week 3
Things are going pretty good I think. However doing full nutes is turning out to be too much. I'm getting quite a lot of burnt tips.
Otherwise, the buds are really starting to form.
So I've backed off to around 3/4 nutes today for this feed.
Foilage = 3.75ml/g
Bloom = 8ml/g
CalMag = 3.75ml/g
BlackStrap = 1tsp/g
PH in = 6.1
PPM in = 927
BB1 out = 6.04 / 890
BB2 out = 6.02 / 922
PK1 out = 6.15 / 756
PK2 out = 5.6 / 855
PH seems to be jumping around a lot even though I've consistently been trying to aim for 6.2. Especially with my PK2 @ 5.6 not sure how that happened. The last watering they were all at around 6.4.
I've been having to use a lot of PH up since after mixing the nutes my ph is around 4.5.
I haven't updated in a while... I'm now on week 5 of flowering. I'd say things are going quite well. I'm starting to find some balance in my feed schedule and PH. I'm pretty sure I starved these girls for most of their life but I'm starting to figure it out.
The purple kush (front 2) is further along than the two blueberries (in the back). One of the blueberries (back right) is weeks behind the other making me think that her genetics are probably different or something else entirely.
Buds are starting to bulk up and a lot of frost on the purple kush.
I'm starting to cool the temps down a little. Trying to stay at around 74-78. I'm starting to see a little purple on the top. I'll try to bring the temps down to about 64-68 by week 7-8.
Did a couple trichome photos to see where I'm at. Looking fairly clear at this stage where it's supposed to be.
Coming along nicely. I'm glad to see you're lowering the temps since they do appear a bit heat stressed. Should be fine though. Nice job so far
@Mr. Grow It Yes! I've been noticing "tacoing" more and more but I don't think it's heat stress. I've kept temps below 78 and have been at 76 for two weeks and I have three fans going. However, the tacoing is occurring on the top half of the plant - makes me think light intensity. I was running the sf4000 at 24" at 100% for a while now. I have a hunch that this is still too intense for some genetics. This is only really happening on my purple kush the blueberries are unaffected. I've dimmed to 85% we'll see how it goes.
I'm also noticing a lot of spotting/yellowing lately. But this is mostly on just one of the blueberries (the one that is 2-3 weeks behind the rest). So today I watered with 450 ppm of CalMag.
My PH has been a bit weird to me. I watered my purple kush's with 6.8 because I've noticed that they always low - like 5.7.. So after the watering with 6.8, I measure it and got 5.7 again! Hahaha.. ok nature - go home you're drunk.
CalMag = 12ml/g
BB Ph in = 6.2
BB1out = 5.86/714
BB2out = 5.74/876
PK Ph in = 6.8
PK1out = 5.7/1000
PK2out = 5.7/1010
I'm just realizing that I probably gave way too much CalMag but we'll see how it goes.
I just found this, nice write up and very informative. Looks like you got it going on, could you stop by and take care of my garden???
Great job looking forward to the out come.
Haha,thanks @quadtrax! I'm so happy I've even got this far.. didn't think I would to be honest. But thanks to this forum and @Mr. Grow It it's getting there. I'll post through to the end my experience as a first time grower. Hopefully it may help some others.
I'll probably post a journal on my second grow as well. Next time I'll be trying Coco + Remo with the same seeds to compare the outcomes. :)
Just read through the entire grow. Remember you can use molasses to help microbes in soil To aid in natural nutrients to be taken by plants. Your plants are looking really good. Way to go congrats
Thanks! yeah... I tried some organic blackstrap on a few feedings but decided since it's my first run, I want to keep it really basic.
Looking a little more cloudy... Some amber appearing.
Flowering week 6 -- day 70 from sprouting. (The strain says 7 - 8 weeks of flowering)
Week 7 of flowering and my 2 PurpleKush's are getting closer than my 2 Blueberries. Getting really bulky and firm.
Everything is looking and smelling amazing.
My trichomes are looking mostly cloudy. I've been trying to take photos of the mid area of the plant.
This one was a bit lower down and looks a little more clear.. maybe?
I like the relaxed indica high.. so I'm going to wait for more amber to show up.
It's all very exciting being my first time doing this. I mistakingly bought miracle-gro potting soil (not researching enough about mediums) and used dyna-gro (considered the "cheap stuff").. I never thought this run would do so well.
Lots of big buds formed! 🌳
@Mr. Grow It Right?! super stoked to move on to the drying and curing.
From what you see, how much time do you think I have left if I'm going for a relaxed indica high?
Should I wait to see more amber before flushing or start that now? (by flushing I mean running PHed water for the remainder of the grow)